This interview was originally recorded on November 9th, 2023.
The Oral History Project is supported by the Arthur F. and Alice E. Adams Charitable Foundation.

Frederica von Stade, mezzo-soprano

Mezzo-soprano Frederica von Stade, affectionately known as “Flicka” to her fans, has enriched the world of classical music for four and a half decades, appearing at the world’s great opera houses and concert halls. A noted bel canto specialist, she excelled as the heroines of Rossini’s La Cenerentola and Il barbiere di Siviglia and Bellini’s La Sonnambula, while also garnering acclaim for her interpretations of Mozart and French repertoire. Beginning with her debut in 1970, she appeared over 300 times at the Metropolitan Opera. Von Stade retired from full-time performing in 2010 but has continued to make special appearances in concert and opera. She has created roles in numerous new works, including Dead Man Walking  (2000), Three Decembers  (2008), A Coffin in Egypt  (2014), and Sky on Swings  (2018).

Transcript

Marc A. Scorca: As I was preparing for this, I was going through some YouTube, and your singing the Rusalka aria in concert years ago, I got weak-kneed thinking I'd get to speak to you.

Frederica von Stade: Oh, you are the best. You really are, and what you've done for opera Marc. Really, I know it's taken heart, soul, time, energy: everything that one can imagine to do it. But gosh, you have just done it.

Marc A. Scorca: I don't wanna have the last word on that, but the reason that I'm so happy doing it, is because of artistry, the way you have delivered over your career. The other night I was home, and I was talking about the fact that I would be interviewing you, and we looked again, on YouTube, at the footage of the (Giorgio) Strehler Marriage of Figaro, which I saw in 1976 - the Bicentennial, and how spectacular that was, how spectacular you were in that. It was such fun to see.

Frederica von Stade: Thank you, Marc.

Marc A. Scorca: Isn't YouTube amazing, what you can watch on it these days?

Frederica von Stade: It's unbelievable. People have sent me videos of things that I didn't even know I knew the music. That's how long ago it was. I thought, "I never sang that. I didn't sing those songs. I don't remember that at all".

Marc A. Scorca: And I will say that some of those evenings at home with YouTube get in the way of my buying a ticket and going to the opera in the opera house, because I can have such a good time sitting on the floor in my pajamas.

Frederica von Stade: I know; it's true. And yet, you walk through that door and magic happens. I came for Jake's (Heggie) Dead Man Walking, and I realized I hadn't been at The Met since I retired.

Marc A. Scorca: Really?

Frederica von Stade: I just haven't. I live in California and I don't get east that much, and when I do, I'm going to see my grandkids. And it hasn't changed; it's still got that magic, you know. And it was just so great to see that.

Marc A. Scorca: Frederica von Stade, I cannot tell you how honored and happy I am to have you as part of our Oral History series. Thank you for taking the time this morning to be with me.

Frederica von Stade: Thank you for having me. And I have to say, officially, I think you have done so much for this opera world that we live in, that is just incomparable in every way. I remember way back to one of your first meetings when I brought all the kids from the youth program I work with, and I was so grateful to have that chance to bring them. Thank you for keeping it alive and going, and interesting and special, which you've done using soul and everything else.

Marc A. Scorca: Flicka, thank you. And we were going to get to your work with young people in a moment. I do remember that performance. And you may recall that the entire audience at our Opera Conference stood up and cheered when it was over, because it was so spectacular.

Frederica von Stade: I remember.

Marc A. Scorca: I start every one of my interviews with the same question, and that is: who brought you to your first opera?

Frederica von Stade: You know, I'm gonna tell you my first opera, and I just can't quite believe it. My Mom took my brother and me on a wonderful trip to Europe when we were teenagers, and she got tickets to see Der Rosenkavalier in Salzburg. And we were driving around in a little VW bug and had trouble parking, and so we're running in the door, in the rain. And my first opera was Der Rosenkavalier with Christa Ludwig and (Elisabeth) Schwarzkopf. Now, you can't fall in love more than that, everything about it. It was just absolutely fantastic.

Marc A. Scorca: What a way to start.

Frederica von Stade: Exactly. Exactly.

Marc A. Scorca: Little did you know that that would wind up being an opera you'd perform in?

Frederica von Stade: I know. All I wanted was to be a Broadway singer, so I hadn't even gone there with opera.

Marc A. Scorca: And it's funny you mention the Salzburg Rosenkavalier, and I was gonna ask whether that was before your habituation in Broadway. I mean, I read in your bio about how much you admired Ethel Merman. Had you already been attracted to Broadway by the time you got to that Salzburg performance?

Frederica von Stade: Yes. From the time I was maybe, I don't know, 10 or 12, I just was in love with Broadway. I played nonstop every Broadway show that was recorded. Remember those days, a record? And I adored Ethel Merman, Mary Martin, and I'd go into see Broadway as a teenager. I have a best friend who's an artist, Tim Lovejoy, and we would take - it was a safer world then - we'd take the train in to New York and we'd go see a matinee. Then we'd stand outside the Metropole Cafe, which played the best jazz in the world. And you didn't have to go in, 'cause they played so that you could see it from the street. I heard Gene Krupa and all these amazing jazz artists. And then we'd go to the evening show, and then we'd take the train home. So every weekend, we saw at least two shows.

Marc A. Scorca: It is the gift of growing up in the New York area to be able to immerse yourself in that way. Did you stand in your bedroom in front of the mirror and sing all of those songs? Were you performing as a youngster as well?

Frederica von Stade: Oh, yeah. We had an upright piano in my Granny's living room, and I'd drag everybody in there and sing. I didn't play the piano, so I would just sing acapella. And my big hit number was (sings) "Whatever Lola wants, Lola gets" from Damn Yankees. I sang all the time, all the time. I was just always singing. And then when I went to to school, we had this amazing teacher who put on plays. And my first pants role was in eighth grade in New Jersey, singing Nanki-Poo in Gilbert and Sullivan's Mikado. She encouraged me, and then I went to Sacred Heart boarding school. There we put on shows. It was Broadway, Broadway, Broadway. For summers, I'd go and work in summer stock and different places. And it was a magic time in Broadway, too. This is the '60's and early '70's...

Marc A. Scorca: Great shows.

Frederica von Stade: It was fantastic.

Marc A. Scorca: And Flicka, so many young, talented people in high school do perform in the musicals that they do. Who's the first person who said, "You know, you have something here".

Frederica von Stade: You know, I don't remember that. I think I just pushed my way through. I think it was probably this Mrs. Noling. Her name was Betty Noling, and she was at the Far Hills Country Day School. And she would teach me and help me. She was very much that kind of a person. She encouraged all young people. And she had that magic sense of discipline - "If you're gonna do this, this is what you have to do". And then in high school, at the convent, it was this wonderful lady named Mrs. Morsbach. And then I started singing lessons with her, and we sang all the time. We sang every mass, every morning in Gregorian chant. So that was terrific training for singing, because it was very plainchant, so it couldn't do any...So I sang that. And then it was after high school that I went to my second opera. Instead of going to college, which wasn't that important in my generation. It wasn't what it is today that you gotta go to university. So I went to live in France instead. And I had a boyfriend, a wonderful boy, who took me to the Paris Opera because he went to the École Militaire, so he was all decked out in sort-of Napoleonic dress, with a sword. And we heard one scene from Carmen. So that was my second opera trip. So you can imagine that made a pretty big impression,

Marc A. Scorca: I should say. But a role you did not sing on stage.

Frederica von Stade: I did not sing on stage. No, no; didn't have the figure or the chops.

Marc A. Scorca: Plenty of other people could sing Carmen. Mannes. So the Mannes School figures a little bit in your trajectory here.

Frederica von Stade: It figures big time. I met at Mannes this incredible man named Sebastian Engelberg, who I hold in my heart for the rest of my life. I was scared to talk to him, and he didn't want to impose on me, but I wanted desperately to study with him. And I eventually got up my nerve and I said, Mr. E, "Can I come study with you?" He was Austrian. He said, "Yes, of course. I've been waiting for you to come". And so I started studying with him, and in the first lesson...I had always thought I had a low voice, 'cause I did a lot of sort-of belting in my Broadway stuff - and in my first lesson with him, I sang a high C and I nearly passed out. I had not had those reverberations up there in a long time. And I adored him. The foundation of his teaching was, "You must sing as though it comes from the bottom of your heart". And the other thing he used to say, when I'd run into lessons panting, 'cause I had a job when I went to Mannes. I was a secretary - the worst secretary in the world. And I'd run into a lesson, "Oh, Mr. E, I didn't do this assignment". He'd look at me, and he said, "So, for you, it should be easy". It was like, "You're so special that you don't have to juggle and work and do all these things. You have to put in the time". And I trusted him with everything, and I adored him. And he had a beautiful voice. He lived in New Jersey, and he'd come in and say, "I wake up this morning, no coffee. Here's my voice". And he'd sing this beautiful phrase.

Marc A. Scorca: Did he get to enjoy some of your great performances?

Frederica von Stade: He came to a few. He was getting pretty old, and he got sick. But the other people we had at Mannes were Felix Popper and Tommy (Thomas) Martin. And, you know, it was a gold mine. I remember we put on Hansel and Gretel once, and the budget to put it on was $50, and our wonderful, wonderful director had us hang fishing poles with homemade trees out of wire, and that was the woods, and just that atmosphere was extraordinary.

Marc A. Scorca: And I knew Felix Popper when I first started working at New York City Opera. I never knew Thomas Martin, but just legendary parts of the American opera scene.

Frederica von Stade: Absolutely. And trained in the European kind of magnificence. They'd heard everybody and anybody sing, and they'd heard cracks and mistakes and all that. And they brought all that wisdom to us at Mannes. I adored Mannes. It was on the east side then, and one of my special times there was: - I have a great friend, named Bliss Rodriguez, who's blind, and I used to dictate music to him. And there was a little bench as you went in, and I was always late for everything, so went rushing in. And he knew everything. And he'd say, "I hear you. I know you're late. Just come and sit down. Let's get to work". And I've done some recordings with him out here in California. He's still going strong. Those Mannes connections are terrific.

Marc A. Scorca: Who was it who said, "Hey, you know, why don't you go down to The Met and audition for them?"

Frederica von Stade: Actually, it was a party time, that time in my life too. So, someone bet me at a cocktail party that I could get a prize in The Metropolitan Opera Auditions. And so I went to Mr. Engelberg and I said, "Do you think I should enter?" He said, "Why not? The worst thing you can get is rejection, and that's showbiz". So I entered, and in those days, there were quite a few layers. You know, you went to this audition, then you got in that one. You went to the next one, and the next one. And I got into the semifinals, and then you were meant to come back for the finals. But the good fortune I had (which wasn't good fortune for The Met) was, it was during the lockout. And during that time, before the finals, when I traveled and I kept up my studies and everything, and then I was asked to come back and audition for comprimario parts. And I got a contract before the finals. And I sang everybody's maid or younger brother, or Ungeborenen (unborn): everything possible. And there at The Met, we had Walter Taussig and Alberta Masiello and these incredible coaches, and the rehearsal time was incredibly strict. And if you were like third cover for the Genie, you went to every single rehearsal. So I got to sit there and listen to these great artists all day long, and then during dress rehearsals on stage, sit in the audience. So, I mean, what better training could there possibly be?

Marc A. Scorca: And knowing that you were there in those years - 'cause the lockout was, I guess, the fall of 1969, and I don't get to often ask this: so Rudolf Bing. What was Bing like?

Frederica von Stade: He was kind of adorable in his way. I used to get on the bus with him, 'cause I lived on the upper west side, and he was always very formal. But I had one adorable time when we were on tour, and we were in Atlanta. And I was sitting next to Mr. Bing. And on the other side was this amazing southern belle who was charming him and said, (with accent) "Oh, Mr. Bing. I'm so delighted that we're all here". And he got cheerier and cheerier as the night went on. And we ended up singing. I sat next to him, singing Schubert songs together, just at the table (demonstrates). And I adored him. I always loved to go in to see him. I remember once I was offered Adalgisa somewhere else. And he said to me, "Flicka, I'll give you the time to do it, but I strongly advise you against it". And it was during the time when Jackie (Marilyn Horne) and Joan Sutherland were...I mean: this little pip squeak from New Jersey is going to sing Adalgisa? And I took his advice, obviously. But I adored him. And, you know, (at) the Met, there was Winnie and Mary behind the desk when you'd come in. "How are you?" And "Hi Sir Rudy", and all this. It was very, very jolly. I was very spoiled.

Marc A. Scorca: Alberta Masiello. So, when I would listen to the Saturday afternoon broadcast, sometimes she would be at an intermission feature, explaining the opera at the piano. I never knew her. What was it like to work with her, as one of these great old Met coaches?

Frederica von Stade: Oh my gosh. She was amazing. I think I covered something in Falstaff: Meg, I think. And, she smoked, you know...

Marc A. Scorca: I didn't know that.

Frederica von Stade: She had a cigarette going, and "No, no, darling. If you wait for that beat, you'd be too late". She was unbelievable. And then she'd sit at the piano, sort of very relaxed. And she'd say, "No, you're going to be late. You're late. I told you you'd be late". It was like manna from heaven to work with someone like that. That's the only time that I did work with her. All the other times I worked a lot with Jan Behr and Walter Taussig. And it was magic.

Marc A. Scorca: And then Rolf Liebermann entered the picture here, and, of course, the great (Giorgio) Strehler Marriage of Figaro figured so importantly in your career. What was Rolf Liebermann like?

Frederica von Stade: I didn't know him terribly well. I'd see him backstage, but he was impressive - quite grand, just by his presence. He didn't have to do anything. I obviously knew Strehler better. Gosh, what a man.

Marc A. Scorca: The production of The Marriage of Figaro is simply imprinted on me, as one of my great opera experiences.

Frederica von Stade: Well, he is a theater man, 'cause he was Piccolo Scala, and when he came to Paris, first we rehearsed every day in Versailles, because the opening was in the Gabriel Theater there, the Marie-Antoinette Theater, and our costumes were original. They were mounted from the Opéra Comique, so that some of the stitching I had on my vest was 18th century. I mean, it was unbelievable. And we'd go out for a break, you know, in Versailles. It was magic. But I remember standing next to him once doing 'Non so più' or 'Voi che sapete' and just standing next to him, it was like this fusion of this incredible energy. And he'd always say, "You don't have to move. Just stand and mean what you say". And he spoke mainly in French to all of us, 'cause we were in Paris. And every day, we would be there very early, and we'd stay very late. And we might work on one recitative for the whole day, 'cause he was a perfectionist, and as soon as they were possible, he wanted all the lights and the costumes and everything. And that production was magic because it captured the different times of day. And he had these beautiful shoes. I remember looking down at his shoes. I mean, how lucky is that to work with a great man?

Marc A. Scorca: Well, you say, "A whole day on a recitative". I wanna say. "So that's what it takes to do work of that quality".

Frederica von Stade: I think we were there for two months before it opened.

Marc A. Scorca: I've said this to you, and I've said it to others that I saw it in New York as part of the Bicentennial in 1976. And that performance was Margaret Price, Mirella Freni, you, José van Dam, Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau conducted by (Georg) Solti, and you stole the show.

Frederica von Stade: No, I did not.

Marc A. Scorca: And you stole the show.

Frederica von Stade: No way. No way. But thank you, Marc.

Marc A. Scorca: I remember it specifically.

Frederica von Stade: You do so much for us opera singers. You really do. Thank you.

Marc A. Scorca: You and Mozart. And Flicka, it was interesting...we had an exercise with our board recently where we asked people to tell us, "What opera character are you feeling like today?" And so many of them cite Mozart characters, and Mozart won by far. And of course, Mozart played such an important role in your career. What about Mozart for you?

Frederica von Stade: Well, I love that exercise. That is fantastic. Because the thing about Mozart is, especially Figaro - Figaro above all else - is that the characters are so real. They are characters ...you've met them every day. Today you've met a Marcellina or a Bartolo. And to begin my career with that genuine sort of representation of music and theater, put together so beautifully. I love Mozart. I think as much for the camaraderie of it, in preparing it. It's the way you end up feeling about all the casts you're with, even if it changes all the time. There's a kind of a closeness that develops in Clemenza di Tito, in Così, in everything that is very, very special and very unique. I always remember having such a good time. Now, of course, I was playing a naughty little boy, so I'm bound to have a good time doing that. But it was that closeness that you always, always felt and that honesty that comes in the music. But, it's challenging. I mean Dorabella, who doesn't get a lot of credit when the applause comes at the end of the opera, is a really hard role to sing. It sits in that kind of high place, but there's a genuineness that it just connects you all the time. And to come to the theater and hear, (sings the first measures of the Figaro overture), what could be better? I also knew from Mr. Engelberg and Matthew Epstein, (who really made my career) that it was safe for me. I wasn't gonna push, or I wasn't going to try and make my voice into something it wasn't. So it was a safety net.

Marc A. Scorca: Now, French opera, because you also are very closely identified with French opera, and even as you pronounce French names, in the course of this conversation, clearly you feel very at home with the language, and as a musician, you were such a great interpreter of it. What about you and French Opera?

Frederica von Stade: Well, I love French Opera, and it is because I was lucky enough to have this amazing teacher in high school. And she was French, and she never spoke to us in English. And she made us read 50 pages, (and 50 pages is a lot) every night of Lamartine or Saint-Exupéry. She said, "You know enough now that if you know three words in a sentence, test your mind to see what else you (think)", and then we would tell her what we thought it was about. And so, by 18, I had a really good handle on speaking French, and that's why I wanted to go live in Paris. And then living in Paris, really, within a month, I was comfortable speaking French. And I was speaking French all day long, and eventually got to the point of thinking in French. And my great friend Tim, who I mentioned before, said when I came back (that) I was so annoying. Instead of saying 'no', I'd say, 'nuhhh....', not 'non' or 'no', just 'nuhhhh'. "Flicka, please, it's 'non' or 'no', let's not have this 'nuhhh'". And I would think, "I'm getting up on the train" instead of "I'm getting on the train". That's how much it became a part of me, and I had a French boyfriend. So I felt...when you get to that point in a language that a word can mean several different things, if you really know it well. I mean 'gris' means 'gray'. And 'gray' can mean all kinds of things. That's where I felt with French. And so being able to sing in French just was magic.

Marc A. Scorca: It's a fantastic literature that doesn't get performed enough.

Frederica von Stade: It doesn't, and I mean, an opera like Mignon...it's really dear. It's very, very dear. It's very humble in its way. And then all the Massenet. I mean, theater pieces, par excellence. They're just filled with dance and high singing, low singing, bass singing, tenor singing. They're extraordinary.

Marc A. Scorca: They really are. I agree with you, and you were so at home in that music. It was always wonderful to hear you sing it.

Frederica von Stade: Thank you. I was very happy. And I got to play girls.

Marc A. Scorca: So, here we're talking about 18th and 19th century opera. But then you became a great creator of new works; of important roles from The Seagull, which I think was your first new opera. I was at the opening of Dangerous Liaisons in San Francisco, and you created that, and of course, Dead Man Walking, such an important opera over the last 20 plus years - this season at The Metropolitan Opera. How different was it for you to take on new opera, compared to your mastery of existing opera?

Frederica von Stade: It wasn't very different. First of all, I was just so happy to be invited. A lot of my career has been based on...there was a TV show called "Say Yes to the Dress". Sometimes I'm asked to do things and I think like three minutes. And I think, "Why not?" If they're gonna ask me to do it, and they think I can do it, so why prove them wrong, or just turn it down. Think of the experience of learning that I can't do it. So when I was asked to do these operas, I said yes, with great joy. I love Dangerous Liaisons. Oh my gosh, I got to play the meanest woman in the world; it was heaven. I'd played young girls and boys, and then discovering the world of Jake (Heggie) has been the greatest gift of my life. We knew each other, way back when, when he was in the press department at San Francisco Opera, and we used to ride to radio interviews together and have a wonderful time. And then he played his arrangements, and I thought, "My gosh, there's a little bit of Debussy in there, and there's Lenny Bernstein, and there's Sondheim", but it's all Jake. It is all these great sounds and great, great, great commitment to words. Jake Heggie is a man of letters. He is so beautifully educated, and every day of his life is learning something new. And he treasures words. And that's why his wonderful combination for this latest opera that he did, Intelligence... Did you see it, Marc?

Marc A. Scorca: I did. I was in Houston last week.

Frederica von Stade: I just flew down for the day and my jaw was like that (opens mouth wide). It was so exquisite. And a new Jake. I think it's one of his best things ever. But he's been so much a part of my venturing into being asked to do other things.

Marc A. Scorca: So, just the idea of doing Cherubino for the 50th time, and somehow you have to keep it fresh. You're doing a brand new opera where there's no history of performance at all; no recording you could listen to. How do you keep the old repertoire fresh? How do you crack the spine of a score of something that you've never seen before?

Frederica von Stade: With a little bit of trepidation. I always read everything first, very carefully. And then I start...I'm not a very good musician. I shouldn't say this because of Mannes, because I was beautifully trained, but I didn't work hard enough, and so music is a real challenge for me. I have a lot of trouble with rhythm, 'cause I have dyslexia, and so all these kinds of things. So then I just go little by little with the music, and then all of a sudden it gets in your head and it gets in your brain and it starts to make sense. And it's sort of like a baby learning to walk. They fall down a lot, but then they get back up and they try, and eventually they get it. And so it's a really thrilling experience for me. And then to be able to work with the composer - with, you know, with Ricky Ian Gordon. I had the time of my life working with Ricky. I just adore that man. He's such a brilliant composer and such a dear human and so full of theater. And I even got to work with Sondheim. He came and directed A Little Night Music when we did it in Houston a long time ago. And he came for three days. And I mean, to work with Sondheim... It was fantastic. And he kept saying to me, "No Flicka, it has to be meaner". (sings) "Isn't it rich? Are we a pair?". "You have to have that edge to it". I kept trying to make her nice ...by my years of training and Cenerentola, and all that. But, how lucky has it been? I just keep saying that.

Marc A. Scorca: So the other side of the coin, which is doing your 50th performance of Cherubino, how would you keep it fresh?

Frederica von Stade: I think it's so well written. It's so clear that the music makes it clear from (sings the first notes of "Non so più"), right from the beginning. And it's always different because you're playing to a new Susanna, or a new Conte or Figaro, so it always was different. I played it beyond the years of decency. I maybe couldn't run quite as fast as I would've liked to, but, you know, opera is pretend. It is pretend. We are pretending. We're basing it on human experience. It's all based on reality, the reality of human nature. But it is pretend, and it is so much fun to pretend and to spend your life pretending, and I grew up in a generation when everything was pretend. We didn't have games and phones. We were making up stories. And so, it's pretense. It's that joy of pretending to be. And I can still feel it, when I hear it. I still feel like I wanna run around the room. Limp around the room a little bit, but it still gets in you, that excitement.

Marc A. Scorca: I love to hear you say that.

Frederica von Stade: I do adore opera and I appreciate every single note that I've ever heard or sung in my life, but my heart does belong to Broadway. And I walk in that theater and I hear three notes, and my heart starts beating faster. And even if it's not a great show...I'm taking my grandkids to a show. They're coming in December and we're trying to decide what to take them to. It'll probably be one of the standards, but I'm so much more excited than they are.

Marc A. Scorca: Flicka, any role models in your career? People, whether they knew it or not, that you thought about or...what would Malibran have done? Were there any role models?

Frederica von Stade: Oh, Janet Baker and Jackie (Marilyn Horne). And my role model was as much for their singing, as who they were; who they are. Jackie: she really means the world to me. There's something about her presence. She walks in a room and it's deep inside of her. She's not created it. She is it. And it's this generosity of spirit. And the way she dealt with everything in her life, and in her career that I knew - that I was privy to in some way, was so based on that generous spirit and that affirmation of music, and affirmation of singing, and affirmation of humanity. You know how direct she was? You couldn't resist that. With my very Catholic upbringing and years of nuns, and treasuring humility above all else - to feel that openness around her was one of the biggest gifts that I ever had. And I loved Henry (Lewis) as well. I used to work with Henry. He had that same magic. I'll never forget all my times with Jackie. And the same with Janet. I didn't know her as well, but we did one recording together. And when she sang Ulisse at Glyndebourne, I went to every single rehearsal that I could, and I went to every single performance, 'cause I think it was probably one of the greatest operatic, theater, vocal, musical experience I've had in my life. It was the Ray (Raymond) Leppard version, which was extraordinary. It was Peter Hall's production. Janet: it was like, this is a direct communication from God. That's the only place it could come from. And that's who she is. I had a funny experience with her, I tell you. We were recording and Yvonne Minton was singing, and Janet and I were sitting behind waiting to do a recitative, and I was thinking this unbelievably base thought that - as Yvonne was singing, her bottom was making funny movements. And I thought, "That is so coarse and base of you to even have a thought like that". And Janet at that point turned over to me and said, "Aren't bottoms the strangest things? They're part of vocal technique". And you couldn't resist her. I always felt a little bit around her like she was made of this absolutely pure crystal, and I was afraid to touch it or come near her, 'cause to me she was sacred. She IS sacred, but I mean, her performances...

Marc A. Scorca: Yeah. Wow.

Frederica von Stade: And my other inspirations are all tenors...

Marc A. Scorca: They can sing too.

Frederica von Stade: Luciano (Pavarotti) and Plácido (Domingo). They're best in the world.

Marc A. Scorca: So the Young Musicians Choral Orchestra, that's the group that performed at our annual conference.

Frederica von Stade: That's right.

Marc A. Scorca: And they did a medley from Les Mis. It was extraordinary. So how did you become involved with them, Flicka?

Frederica von Stade: I got involved through a friend of mine, Jim Meredith, who's a pianist in this area. And he's been involved with them for 30 years. It used to be under the umbrella of Cal. So it's a very prestigious organization. And then they broke off from Cal a number of years ago. It used to be called YMP and became YMCO. And it was run by this brilliant woman, who was a great soprano, named Daisy Newman. And she passed away two years ago. And it's been taken over by this extraordinary man, who was there for that performance - Geechi Taylor, who is a jazz trumpet player. And his effort, along with one of our graduates, who is his assistant has kept it going through Covid, through Daisy's death, through all kinds of things. And we're just getting a strong foundation. We have some new board members, and we're getting a development director. It's a program that targets kids who would never otherwise have musical training. So, for a while we had a thing that the families couldn't earn over a certain amount of money, or they didn't qualify, 'cause everything's free. We have an intensive summer institute. Our kids are as young as eight, but we try to keep it around nine or ten to 18. And they have to sing, and they have to play an instrument, and they have to participate in orchestra and choir. And they very often we assign their instruments, but they can choose them as well. And they get all their private training in their instrument. They come together all day Sundays, because of school. And the purpose of it is - yes, to train them as musicians and human beings, because very much a part of the organization is this magic triangle that Daisy instituted, which is musicianship, grades and citizenship. They have to behave. And (the purpose) is to get 'em into college. And most of them are the first person to go to college in their families. And we have the eight kids who graduated last year, about half of them had 4.0. And they don't necessarily have to go in music. They go in science or whatever. But I have just adored this program from its conception. And I'm on the board and I do a lot with the kids. I make lunches on Sundays and hear them all the time, and try and include them in as many performances. One or two of our young musicians participated in an event at San Francisco Opera last year. I'm so proud of them. I'm so proud of what they accomplish.

Marc A. Scorca: They were so incredible when they were with us at the conference. Now what about the People's Choir of Oakland? I hear that this is another new endeavor of yours.

Frederica von Stade: It is. And it's flopped, I'm sad to say.

Marc A. Scorca: I didn't know that. I'm sorry.

Frederica von Stade: We couldn't get funding. But we're coming back with a fully volunteer (basis). We put a choir together at a respite center at a center called St. Vincent de Paul in Oakland, which serves the homeless, and we had a fabulous choir director, an administrator. We had a therapist and a manager, and we operated for a year and a half. And then, because we were only serving maybe 10 or 12 people who came, we couldn't get more funding to keep going. So now we're getting it going on a totally volunteer basis. And fortunately, St. Vincent de Paul has started serving in-house meals. Before, they would pass them out during Covid. And now we're back, and so we're starting to organize just musical performances during the meals. And if I can get enough volunteers, we will resume the choir during the hours that they're open, which is 10 to four, in another room, and just do a little choir singing.

Marc A. Scorca: Oh, how wonderful.

Frederica von Stade: But I tell you, the gift of meeting some of the people that we did,. They've become friends and they're so wonderful. Everyone should have the joy of getting to know this community. And the amazing work that a friend of mine does with the Dallas Street Choir is just extraordinary. And he's kept that going for years now. And they do perform. They've sung in temple. They've sung in Yiddish. They just go everywhere. And that's still going strong.

Marc A. Scorca: Oh, how fabulous.

Frederica von Stade: This wonderful Jonathan Palant.

Marc A. Scorca: I know how much this means to you. And it is such important work.

Frederica von Stade: Yeah. It's part of our world today.

Marc A. Scorca: And we have to be part of the solution.

Frederica von Stade: We do. We absolutely do. And it's not hard to see the value of knowing these people and helping in even the tiniest way.

Marc A. Scorca: So you must be approached all the time for advice; advice as a singer, advice as a good person in the world. What is at the core of your advice to young people who approach you for counsel?

Frederica von Stade: I think it's based on Mr. Engelberg's words. "Sing as though it comes from the bottom of your heart". And that's easy enough to say, you can just quote it. But really, that's what singing is about. It's communication, and we're lucky enough in our opera world to be almost the last place where it goes from throat to ear without electronic interference. And consequently, we have to treasure that: treasure (it) the way you have, because that's what's so important about it. And the advice I ever give a young singer, is to mean it; mean what you sing. Just mean it. It sounds so trite, but it's so easy to get confused with all the vocal information that they get in conservatory. That's gives them the means to their instrument. They've gotta have it. But when they're out there, when they're singing an aria, if you mean it, all of that takes all the confusion and the duress of that goes away, and that's what we're given. We have words. A violinist doesn't have words. Pianists don't have words. We've got words that we can put our gusto in with our whole heart and soul and mind. You know, very often if I hear a kid in a masterclass and they seem a little bit sort of nervous, scared, whatever... you know, singers tend to be so hard on themselves. We all have these judges that sit on our shoulders, and the way you can knock those judges off your shoulder is by meaning what you say, because you don't have time for them to listen to it, critique what you just did. Yeah; you cracked. Big deal. Big deal. Cracking may be the door to something else.

Marc A. Scorca: Well, what I can say is, this conversation is just all the exhibit we need as to why we are inducting you into the Opera Hall of Fame this January, here at the National Opera Center. Years ago, people would say, "Oh, Flicka is the nicest person in the world." And I go, "Mm-Hmm, everyone says Flicka is the nicest...". And then I got to know you. And you are the nicest person in the world. So, I'm so happy to have this time with you today. Thank you. Thank you.

Frederica von Stade: Marc, I have to thank you one more time for what you do for opera and what you have done.